drpepperTX

Champion Author
Texas
Posts:8,950 Points:753,185 Joined:Apr 2011
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Message Posted: May 7, 2012 7:09:13 PM
As for the false information LemmeEatCake claims abounds below...
I just went to the Fracfocus site and the first page of the search for wells had this listed as the latest well recorded,by the way there's no diesel used in this one and of the hundreds I've looked at I have not seen diesel used. Could it be that Oblame-a is just spouting off to look good to his enviro buddies? Just asking?
Here's the well info:
Total Water Volume (gal)*: 2,474,850 True Vertical Depth (TVD): 7,340 Production Type: GAS Long/Lat Projection: NAD27 Latitude: 32.690344 Longitude: -97.316614 Well Name and Number: WATSON SOUTH 2H Operator Name: CHESAPEAKE API Number: 4243935796 County: TARRANT State: TEXAS
Hydraulic Fracturing Fluid Composition:
Fresh Water 89.79% Ottawa Sand 9.10% Crystalline Silica (Quartz Sand, Silicon) 0.50811% Phenol/Formaldehyde Resin 0.02619% Hexamethylenetetramine (Hexamine) 0.00524% Water 0.39966% Hydrogen Chloride 0.07053% Methanol (Methyl Alcohol) 0.00065% Aliphatic acid 0.00049% Aliphatic alcohols, ethoxylated 0.00049% Sodium Erythorbate 0.00042% Carbohydrate polymer 0.01097% Petroleum Distillate Hydrotreated Light 0.02099% Aliphatic alcohol polyglycol ether 0.00105% Ammonium Persulfate 0.00053% Chlorine Dioxide 0.00056%
Sodium Polycarboxylate TRADE SECRET 0.01922%
And surprise, surprise and looky there! The trade secret aka "secret sauce" by the fear mongerers is listed right there!
See that too PDQ?
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Edpap

Champion Author
Pennsylvania
Posts:4,336 Points:507,900 Joined:Oct 2011
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Message Posted: May 7, 2012 9:13:06 AM
Are the same Scientists who lied about global warming telling us that fracking is safe?....How do we know which "Scientists" to believe?
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drpepperTX

Champion Author
Texas
Posts:8,950 Points:753,185 Joined:Apr 2011
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Message Posted: May 7, 2012 8:55:03 AM
Sure is quiet from PDQ.
Is PDQ's misinformation the kind of which you speak letmeeatcake?
[Edited by: drpepperTX at 5/7/2012 9:00:32 AM EST]
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drpepperTX

Champion Author
Texas
Posts:8,950 Points:753,185 Joined:Apr 2011
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 10:31:00 PM
OrphancarguyPE "If you can read between the lines of what is what--all sorts of horizontal fault lines being injected and used instead of one vertical line, and in tighter more intensive formation, any use of chemicals that can harm water quality are troubling."
Like you say, "reading between the lines", but horizontal techniques have been used in conjunction with hydraulic fracturing since the 1980's. Reading between those lines, there have been no 'troubling' effects proven either.
Just saying! :=)
By the way, I'm right there with you as technology continues to improve the process such as using natural gas compounds and other techniques to recover and reuse the waste waters.
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drpepperTX

Champion Author
Texas
Posts:8,950 Points:753,185 Joined:Apr 2011
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 9:38:30 PM
Since PDQ seems to have trouble using the insert link feature, here it is: Fracfocus page what chemicals are used
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LetemEatCake

Champion Author
Oklahoma City
Posts:5,596 Points:1,206,355 Joined:Mar 2008
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 9:37:00 PM
Amen Brothers! False Information abounds!
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drpepperTX

Champion Author
Texas
Posts:8,950 Points:753,185 Joined:Apr 2011
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 9:36:08 PM
Wow PDQ shows his/her ineptitude once more! Here's you go, I'll do it for you! LOL!Hydrochloric Acid 007647-01-0 Helps dissolve minerals and initiate cracks in the rock Acid
Glutaraldehyde 000111-30-8 Eliminates bacteria in the water that produces corrosive by-products Biocide Quaternary Ammonium Chloride 012125-02-9 Eliminates bacteria in the water that produces corrosive by-products Biocide Quaternary Ammonium Chloride 061789-71-1 Eliminates bacteria in the water that produces corrosive by-products Biocide Tetrakis Hydroxymethyl-Phosphonium Sulfate 055566-30-8 Eliminates bacteria in the water that produces corrosive by-products Biocide Ammonium Persulfate 007727-54-0 Allows a delayed break down of the gel Breaker Sodium Chloride 007647-14-5 Product Stabilizer Breaker Magnesium Peroxide 014452-57-4 Allows a delayed break down the gel Breaker Magnesium Oxide 001309-48-4 Allows a delayed break down the gel Breaker Calcium Chloride 010043-52-4 Product Stabilizer Breaker Choline Chloride 000067-48-1 Prevents clays from swelling or shifting Clay Stabilizer Tetramethyl ammonium chloride 000075-57-0 Prevents clays from swelling or shifting Clay Stabilizer Sodium Chloride 007647-14-5 Prevents clays from swelling or shifting Clay Stabilizer Isopropanol 000067-63-0 Product stabilizer and / or winterizing agent Corrosion Inhibitor Methanol 000067-56-1 Product stabilizer and / or winterizing agent Corrosion Inhibitor Formic Acid 000064-18-6 Prevents the corrosion of the pipe Corrosion Inhibitor Acetaldehyde 000075-07-0 Prevents the corrosion of the pipe Corrosion Inhibitor Petroleum Distillate 064741-85-1 Carrier fluid for borate or zirconate crosslinker Crosslinker Hydrotreated Light Petroleum Distillate 064742-47-8 Carrier fluid for borate or zirconate crosslinker Crosslinker Potassium Metaborate 013709-94-9 Maintains fluid viscosity as temperature increases Crosslinker Triethanolamine Zirconate 101033-44-7 Maintains fluid viscosity as temperature increases Crosslinker Sodium Tetraborate 001303-96-4 Maintains fluid viscosity as temperature increases Crosslinker Boric Acid 001333-73-9 Maintains fluid viscosity as temperature increases Crosslinker Zirconium Complex 113184-20-6 Maintains fluid viscosity as temperature increases Crosslinker Borate Salts N/A Maintains fluid viscosity as temperature increases Crosslinker Ethylene Glycol 000107-21-1 Product stabilizer and / or winterizing agent. Crosslinker Methanol 000067-56-1 Product stabilizer and / or winterizing agent. Crosslinker Polyacrylamide 009003-05-8 “Slicks” the water to minimize friction Friction Reducer Petroleum Distillate 064741-85-1 Carrier fluid for polyacrylamide friction reducer Friction Reducer Hydrotreated Light Petroleum Distillate 064742-47-8 Carrier fluid for polyacrylamide friction reducer Friction Reducer Methanol 000067-56-1 Product stabilizer and / or winterizing agent. Friction Reducer Ethylene Glycol 000107-21-1 Product stabilizer and / or winterizing agent. Friction Reducer Guar Gum 009000-30-0 Thickens the water in order to suspend the sand Gelling Agent Petroleum Distillate 064741-85-1 Carrier fluid for guar gum in liquid gels Gelling Agent Hydrotreated Light Petroleum Distillate 064742-47-8 Carrier fluid for guar gum in liquid gels Gelling Agent Methanol 000067-56-1 Product stabilizer and / or winterizing agent. Gelling Agent Polysaccharide Blend 068130-15-4 Thickens the water in order to suspend the sand Gelling Agent Ethylene Glycol 000107-21-1 Product stabilizer and / or winterizing agent. Gelling Agent Citric Acid 000077-92-9 Prevents precipitation of metal oxides Iron Control Acetic Acid 000064-19-7 Prevents precipitation of metal oxides Iron Control Thioglycolic Acid 000068-11-1 Prevents precipitation of metal oxides Iron Control Sodium Erythorbate 006381-77-7 Prevents precipitation of metal oxides Iron Control Lauryl Sulfate 000151-21-3 Used to prevent the formation of emulsions in the fracture fluid Non-Emulsifier Isopropanol 000067-63-0 Product stabilizer and / or winterizing agent. Non-Emulsifier Ethylene Glycol 000107-21-1 Product stabilizer and / or winterizing agent. Non-Emulsifier Sodium Hydroxide 001310-73-2 Adjusts the pH of fluid to maintains the effectiveness of other components, such as crosslinkers pH Adjusting Agent Potassium Hydroxide 001310-58-3 Adjusts the pH of fluid to maintains the effectiveness of other components, such as crosslinkers pH Adjusting Agent Acetic Acid 000064-19-7 Adjusts the pH of fluid to maintains the effectiveness of other components, such as crosslinkers pH Adjusting Agent Sodium Carbonate 000497-19-8 Adjusts the pH of fluid to maintains the effectiveness of other components, such as crosslinkers pH Adjusting Agent Potassium Carbonate 000584-08-7 Adjusts the pH of fluid to maintains the effectiveness of other components, such as crosslinkers pH Adjusting Agent Copolymer of Acrylamide and Sodium Acrylate 025987-30-8 Prevents scale deposits in the pipe Scale Inhibitor Sodium Polycarboxylate N/A Prevents scale deposits in the pipe Scale Inhibitor Phosphonic Acid Salt N/A Prevents scale deposits in the pipe Scale Inhibitor Lauryl Sulfate 000151-21-3 Used to increase the viscosity of the fracture fluid Surfactant Ethanol 000064-17-5 Product stabilizer and / or winterizing agent. Surfactant Naphthalene 000091-20-3 Carrier fluid for the active surfactant ingredients Surfactant Methanol 000067-56-1 Product stabilizer and / or winterizing agent. Surfactant
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PDQBlues

Champion Author
San Diego
Posts:7,079 Points:1,449,300 Joined:Jan 2009
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 9:22:39 PM
Thank you, orphancarguyPE, for your intelligent thoughts and insights. All too true. There's a big deception going on with these fracking corporations. As with drpepperTX's claims that there has been full disclosure to the public, even listing a site he claims has this list. But anyone looking will find no specific chemical listed other that WATER. Truly hilarious, really, such deceptions.
Look for yourself:
http://fracfocus.org/water-protection/drilling-usage
http://fracfocus.org/sites/default/files/chemical-in-fracing-chart.jpg
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orphancarguyPE

Champion Author
PEI
Posts:3,853 Points:735,965 Joined:Jan 2011
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 9:01:33 PM
In answer to renegadegas and others that point out quite rightly that fracking has been around forever, they are right, it has. However, HOW it is used and the consequences of WHERE (what underlying rock structure) it is used has changed quite dramatically from 'conventional' oil or gas (or water, for that matter) well drilling, to how it is used now in shale rock formations. By the way, all oil found in rock is NOT the same by any means--there is a sneaky huge difference between "shale oil" (and gas) and "oil shales".
A good simple primer on old fracking versus new fracking is here: http://www.boulderweekly.com/article-7892-boulder%E2%80%99s-fracking-roots.html
If you can read between the lines of what is what--all sorts of horizontal fault lines being injected and used instead of one vertical line, and in tighter more intensive formation, any use of chemicals that can harm water quality are troubling.
For fracking, an ingenious solution to using water and toxic chemicals and solvents, incompletely recovered, has been created by a Canadian company using natural gas compounds themselves
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LetemEatCake

Champion Author
Oklahoma City
Posts:5,596 Points:1,206,355 Joined:Mar 2008
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 8:23:17 PM
Who is Letmeeatcake?
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Tehbob

Champion Author
California
Posts:2,296 Points:457,605 Joined:Jan 2012
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 7:09:37 PM
see
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drpepperTX

Champion Author
Texas
Posts:8,950 Points:753,185 Joined:Apr 2011
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 3:44:34 PM
Let's see, over 350,000 wells have been drilled in the Pennsylavania. Out of these hundreds of thousands of wells there have been how many proven cases of aquifer contamination from hydraulic fracturing? Zip, nada, zero and zilch. Yet the witch hunt continues.
Letmeeatcake says "I would be interested in citations from mainstream media regarding a "majority of Liberals are against NG". ============== That assertion is my opinion, perhaps you would like to provide credible 'citation' to the contrary.
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johntxx

Champion Author
Texas
Posts:2,784 Points:617,070 Joined:Aug 2011
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 2:36:07 PM
Agreed, another flawed attack.
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BBopp

Champion Author
Dayton
Posts:6,839 Points:1,938,455 Joined:Dec 2006
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 1:04:22 PM
Very interesting article.
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LetemEatCake

Champion Author
Oklahoma City
Posts:5,596 Points:1,206,355 Joined:Mar 2008
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 10:46:18 AM
I know of no "liberal" whom are against NG. I have been preaching the Pickens Plan before you were a GB member. Stereotyping or profiling of any group, political or otherwise, is dangerous business. It can lead to misinformation as truth, or worse.
GB is a discussion site where member exchange ideas… It is NOT a battlefield for inflammatory comments. It is OK to disagree about the issues, but do give Peace a Chance!
I would be interested in citations from mainstream media regarding a "majority of Liberals are against NG".
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drpepperTX

Champion Author
Texas
Posts:8,950 Points:753,185 Joined:Apr 2011
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 10:28:04 AM
This is a prime example of how the fracking issue helps explain why it is so hard for conservatives and liberals to find common ground.
The majority of liberals are against natural gas because it is a "non-renewable" energy source that has to be extracted from the earth. There are vast reserves of cheap domestic energy in the ground, that is beyond dispute. But the left wants us to act like its not there. Regardless the income it provides to the people and businesses, how many good jobs the natural gas industry has brought to the country, or how much of a boon it is to the demolish economies.
Liberals must love to demolish one of their favorite narratives. Laughably they'll embrace science while saying the right rejects it. But when millions of people, thousands of scientists, and hundreds of communities find fracking to be a stable and safe way to create jobs, increase the tax base, and fuel our nation, they'll reject it. Only the truly pessimistic and leftist among us will fail to acknowledge these undeniable benefits.
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db60

All-Star Author
Indiana
Posts:982 Points:211,255 Joined:Oct 2011
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 9:52:37 AM
Very good post.
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LetemEatCake

Champion Author
Oklahoma City
Posts:5,596 Points:1,206,355 Joined:Mar 2008
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 9:34:14 AM
Vividly said 07skydriver...agree.
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Jeff1944

Champion Author
South Dakota
Posts:4,236 Points:1,074,760 Joined:Jan 2010
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 9:23:34 AM
Ultimately, there may be conseqences to using benezene.
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qwerty17

Champion Author
New Jersey
Posts:3,655 Points:1,118,650 Joined:Oct 2009
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 7:44:31 AM
yikes.
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07skydriver

Champion Author
Ohio
Posts:3,264 Points:984,040 Joined:Feb 2009
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 6:58:08 AM
The earth is not your personal toilet,
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wrunner

Champion Author
Virginia
Posts:4,450 Points:1,137,560 Joined:Dec 2009
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 6:14:24 AM
Potable water will become more scarce than gas and oil in the very, very near future.
Destroy the environment, kill the human race.
If not directly, time will do it to mankind eventually.
[Edited by: wrunner at 5/6/2012 6:15:51 AM EST]
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UseLessGasFolks

Champion Author
Iowa
Posts:5,451 Points:1,296,825 Joined:Jul 2007
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 2:30:59 AM
"Scientists have theorized that impermeable layers of rock would keep the fluid, which contains benzene and other dangerous chemicals, safely locked nearly a mile below water supplies"
Are we really going to trust our precious water supply to theory?
We need to KNOW that it can not and will not result in contamination.
Right now we do not know that.
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MN1

Champion Author
Twin Cities
Posts:3,364 Points:651,565 Joined:Jun 2011
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 1:30:21 AM
Oops.
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RENEGADEGAS

Champion Author
Missouri
Posts:14,918 Points:1,592,200 Joined:Jul 2008
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 1:26:37 AM
If this were true, the fluids are already there. Fracking has been going on for decades. Since the story is not true, dont worry about it.
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benjy

Champion Author
Chicago
Posts:8,597 Points:1,789,395 Joined:Nov 2003
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 1:19:29 AM
what the frack..
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koikaze

Veteran Author
Sacramento
Posts:397 Points:110,300 Joined:Aug 2011
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 1:12:30 AM
this is just annoying now
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FlyNFool

Champion Author
South Carolina
Posts:8,244 Points:1,685,950 Joined:Aug 2008
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 12:37:22 AM
That's what water filters are for!
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fracknsave

Champion Author
Grand Rapids
Posts:1,666 Points:58,000 Joined:Mar 2012
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 12:26:07 AM
Liberals trying to predict the future is a lot like picking the winning lotto numbers. Take oil... 1970's - we're almost out - oops 1080's - it's polluting the environment - where is oil's Chernobyl? 1990's - it's wrecking the environment - I say again 2000's - it's killing the world - the world gasps its last breath 2010's - no matter how much green costs, it is worth it... - amen sister
meanwhile, the religion of ecology (unfounded) strangles the economy and the power hungry gub'rment meddles in the marketplace to unsustainable proportions.
[Edited by: fracknsave at 5/6/2012 12:27:59 AM EST]
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bg_

Rookie Author
Austin
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 12:24:59 AM
Bs,Bs,Bs,BS...
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JohnofGB

Champion Author
Flint
Posts:5,426 Points:1,097,170 Joined:Feb 2010
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 12:23:33 AM
Then explain to me why after fracking that has been used for over 50 years, has not caused this to happen yet????
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apiergallini

Veteran Author
North Carolina
Posts:389 Points:244,855 Joined:Mar 2011
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 12:14:56 AM
@NHLiveFree
Exactly!
@Beaveronparade
Agreed. You can always resume fracking in the future if you find out it's perfectly safe, but there's no undoing it once the water has been contaminated.
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Beaveronparade

Champion Author
Hartford
Posts:2,105 Points:635,825 Joined:Mar 2011
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 12:12:32 AM
This is not good news at all. I think we definitely need mre information on this process. Safety should always be first.
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BEGTWO

Champion Author
Maryland
Posts:1,947 Points:725,115 Joined:Sep 2010
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 12:11:57 AM
OH ... NO!!! :-(
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ratboy1968

Champion Author
Montreal
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Message Posted: May 6, 2012 12:02:35 AM
ok
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apiergallini

Veteran Author
North Carolina
Posts:389 Points:244,855 Joined:Mar 2011
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Message Posted: May 5, 2012 11:57:04 PM
Ok
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LetemEatCake

Champion Author
Oklahoma City
Posts:5,596 Points:1,206,355 Joined:Mar 2008
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Message Posted: May 5, 2012 11:54:19 PM
GT3186...
No worse from my standpoint than Heritage Foundation 'news'. We each have our own poison now don't we?
Well said...NHLiveFree!
[Edited by: LetemEatCake at 5/5/2012 11:54:43 PM EST]
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NHLiveFree

Champion Author
New Hampshire
Posts:11,095 Points:1,623,180 Joined:Jun 2008
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Message Posted: May 5, 2012 11:12:09 PM
The entire drilling industry is long overdue for real standards, quality assurance and reliable testing. Simply pumping their 'wastewater' back into the ground under pressure is absurd and dangerous. No one needs this extra energy at the risk of water supplies across the country. The industry needs to do a lot more accountability for its practices.
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bandannaman

Champion Author
New Jersey
Posts:1,849 Points:365,610 Joined:Dec 2010
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Message Posted: May 5, 2012 10:52:25 PM
Unbelievable.
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MidNJ

Champion Author
New Jersey
Posts:7,559 Points:1,173,100 Joined:Sep 2009
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Message Posted: May 5, 2012 10:40:43 PM
More research is needed, and not by the gas drilling companies that will skew the research in their favor.
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aquarinut

Champion Author
British Columbia
Posts:1,628 Points:436,855 Joined:Jul 2011
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Message Posted: May 5, 2012 10:11:51 PM
And even a smaller number of people outside of the real scientific community trying to put forward a media hyped, sky falling, end of earth calamity if we don't listen....
OK... enough finger poking and verbal jousting.... just show where the "real" data is originating from... screw theories, computer models, guesstimation, drama, movies, forward looking, CRAP!!!
Take REAL samples, confirm with landmark researchers, prove the data, and quit trying to support causes with hollywood theatrics!!
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TomT2Lee

Champion Author
Cincinnati
Posts:5,357 Points:1,597,980 Joined:Sep 2005
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Message Posted: May 5, 2012 9:58:18 PM
Humans tend to ignore most things until it directly impacts them. Given the small number of people that actually live around where fracking has taken place, it is no wonder that most people think little of it.
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SammyAdams

Champion Author
Tallahassee
Posts:3,057 Points:793,605 Joined:Nov 2010
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Message Posted: May 5, 2012 9:47:15 PM
From the article:
"The study did not use sampling or case histories to assess contamination risks. Rather, it used software and computer modeling to predict how fracking fluids would move over time."
and
"Myers says monitoring systems could be installed around gas well sites to measure for changes in water quality, a measure required for some gold mines, for example. Until that happens, Myers said, theoretical modeling has to substitute for hard data."
=================================================================
It is evident that drpepperTX and aquarinut have nailed the flaws in this study and it would be superfluous to add further comment. The extreme environmentalist lobby will not stop their "fear mongering" until we are forced to live on a cold and dark planet where THEY are the caretakers.
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CVA19

Champion Author
Salem
Posts:2,393 Points:610,325 Joined:Aug 2011
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Message Posted: May 5, 2012 9:47:12 PM
ProPublica - another eco-socialist/progressive web-rag trying to pass itself off as a purveyor of objective journalism. Their list of "supporters" reveals their true colors - leftist to the core.
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drpepperTX

Champion Author
Texas
Posts:8,950 Points:753,185 Joined:Apr 2011
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Message Posted: May 5, 2012 9:36:51 PM
LOL, so true aquarinut, the only water migration here would be through the massive holes in this theory!
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aquarinut

Champion Author
British Columbia
Posts:1,628 Points:436,855 Joined:Jul 2011
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Message Posted: May 5, 2012 9:15:51 PM
""We were trying to use the basic concepts of groundwater and hydrology and geology and say can this happen?" he said. "And that had basically never been done.""
Trying to use??, Had basically never been done???
Another greenie "sky is falling" article to try and make their point with fear mongering!
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drpepperTX

Champion Author
Texas
Posts:8,950 Points:753,185 Joined:Apr 2011
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Message Posted: May 5, 2012 9:11:20 PM
From the propublica, snickers, 'project' page piece - "Several scientists called Myers' approach unsophisticated and said that the assumptions he used for his models didn't reflect what they knew about the geology of the Marcellus Shale. If fluids could flow as quickly as Myers asserts, said Terry Engelder, a professor of geosciences at Penn State University who has been a proponent of shale development, fracking wouldn't be necessary to open up the gas deposits." ---------------- Just another seriously flawed 'study', actually pre-programmed computer model (again flawed) from Tom Myers, a consultant (key word) in hydrogeology. His clients? The federal government and environmental groups. Additionally, who paid for this? Why the Catskill Mountainkeeper and the Park Foundation of course, two upstate New York organizations that have opposed gas drilling and fracking in the Marcellus! Surprise, surprise!!!
Also, the study did not use sampling or case histories to assess contamination risks. Gee, wonder why???
Good grief, let's have some real, unbiased science please!
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drpepperTX

Champion Author
Texas
Posts:8,950 Points:753,185 Joined:Apr 2011
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Message Posted: May 5, 2012 8:58:56 PM
PDQ, "The pollution and toxic chemicals used in fracking will find its way to the aquifers and drinking water. There are plenty of examples already known." ==================== Ooooooh, I eagerly await for PDQ to post a credible source of proof of this accusation. Until then, more unscientific bull feces from PDQ.
[Edited by: drpepperTX at 5/5/2012 8:59:32 PM EST]
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aquarinut

Champion Author
British Columbia
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Message Posted: May 5, 2012 8:55:53 PM
ProPublica......?????? Whatever!
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PDQBlues

Champion Author
San Diego
Posts:7,079 Points:1,449,300 Joined:Jan 2009
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Message Posted: May 5, 2012 8:51:17 PM
The pollution and toxic chemicals used in fracking will find its way to the aquifers and drinking water. There are plenty of examples already known.
Thanks for posting, LetemEatCake.
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